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Apr 4, 2012
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spidermonkey
Joined: Nov 9, 2010
Posts: 189
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See folks, even teachers fail in the attempt to create balanced, well-documented arguments. SecVAlum, I agree with you that we as teachers cannot fully support those fellow teachers that we feel are doing wrong, but "calling them out" is not the proper means to an end, especially without well-documented proof. As professionals, we need to figure out professional ways to try to help each other improve.
However, Combatspeed, yes, we are a "family", I suppose, but if my sister or brother was conducting him/herself in a way that I strongly felt was a detriment to the learning of their kids (i.e. if my sister let her kids spend 3-4 hours a day on videogames midweek, which is absolutely a detriment to their academic development, I would not support her), blind support of them will do no good. Further, more vivid analogies could be made, such as in the military, but I think the point here is clear.
Next, SecValum, I will strongly disagree with you about who is chosen for positions. Good administrators will chose the best candidate, which is difficult enough to find, while other administrators will use other means. I know for a fact of a school that selected 10 applications out of 850 for an elementary ed job and the 10 were selected ONLY based on the fact that they were currently teaching elem. school--that is NOT PROOF that not one of the other 840 applicants were not more qualified. Also, as teachers, we all know that there are a lot of human factors involved in the professional relationships that lead to the selection of people for jobs--this is a natural part of life, as we are all humans. In another school, a full-time sub, certified in Social Studies, was overlooked 3 times for a SS position. So, a person being a part-timer does not automatically mean they get the job--the person could be good, but someone else could just be better.
You still have not brought forth hard "facts" for your speculative opinion of another person. Self policing is fine, and swallowing the pill doesn't have to be so hard, but it is facts, which I agree are sometimes hard to produce that make the person realize they just need to swallow the pill.
Combat speed, the problems with our education are so broad and compounded that limiting it to administrators only compounds it more. I suggest someone start a new web forum for that discussion--maybe our society can one day hope that things can become good again in our country.
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Apr 4, 2012
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Oldskool
Joined: Feb 1, 2004
Posts: 1182
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I just think its too bad he had only 3 yrs to make his mark. Its tough to follow a legend but when you apply for that job you have know the expections. I feel bad that his name and pciture has to be splashed across the newspaper. Coaches get released and fired alll the time and you rarely hear about it.
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Apr 4, 2012
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CombatSpeed
Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 105
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My point is.....until SectionVAlum reveals his "facts", we as a family of teachers, friends, wrestlers, co-workers, etc. etc. should support Coach D'Ambra. I know him as an outstanding citizen, coach, and educator! When reliable and valid evidence is presented to me and our community, then and only then should we determine whether or not the appropriate action was taken. The libel, that SectionVAlum has darkened Coach D's reputation with is despicable. Have a heart for a fellow member of the wrestling community. We gathered around Coach Freischlag and Coach Hirsch, I see no difference with Coach D'Ambra's situation.
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Apr 4, 2012
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Cort72
Joined: Feb 6, 2008
Posts: 104
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Oldskool wrote:I just think its too bad he had only 3 yrs to make his mark. Its tough to follow a legend but when you apply for that job you have know the expections. I feel bad that his name and pciture has to be splashed across the newspaper. Coaches get released and fired alll the time and you rarely hear about it.
I agree with your statement except for the part about feeling bad that his name and and picture being splashed across the newspaper......Who do you think called James Johnson at the D&C? Im sure it was not the AD at S-port.....Give James Johnson a call to find out who contacted him about this and you may change your mind.
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Apr 4, 2012
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vanwilder141
Joined: Oct 12, 2005
Posts: 274
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Mr. Alumni,
I'm not exactly sure what your motives are to post on this forum but I find your comments unfortunate and inappropriate. Unless you have directly observed Mr. D'Ambra within his classroom I'm not sure how you would be able to comment on his proficiency within that setting. In doing so without this experience you sir are committing a defilement of professional character. As a tax payer I would agree with you on one point, educators should be held to a high standard in both practice within their discipline as well as character education. You sir have failed to practice the ladder by airing the dirty laundry of Mr. D'Ambra's within this public forum.
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Apr 4, 2012
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Pearl
Joined: Feb 6, 2012
Posts: 26
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funny comment about bad experiences with administrators. in MY circle, this constitutes #3! oh by the, has to do with AD!
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Apr 4, 2012
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spidermonkey
Joined: Nov 9, 2010
Posts: 189
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CombatSpeed wrote:My point is.....until SectionVAlum reveals his "facts", we as a family of teachers, friends, wrestlers, co-workers, etc. etc. should support Coach D'Ambra. I know him as an outstanding citizen, coach, and educator! When reliable and valid evidence is presented to me and our community, then and only then should we determine whether or not the appropriate action was taken. The libel, that SectionVAlum has darkened Coach D's reputation with is despicable. Have a heart for a fellow member of the wrestling community. We gathered around Coach Freischlag and Coach Hirsch, I see no difference with Coach D'Ambra's situation.
Very good, well-expressed point. Put this way, it is impossible for anyone to argue it.
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Apr 4, 2012
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SectionVAlum
Joined: Apr 3, 2012
Posts: 8
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Very well put. After rereading my first posts I should have never used the word "fact" but instead stuck with observations and for this I apologize. However, people are in turn providing observations and opinions. The matter remains that a teacher was passed over three times while holding a part time position, which is an observation that must be considered in this instance as it can provide insight into the possible reasoning for Mr. D'Ambra's dismissal as coach. I am confused how bringing up actual observations and happenings is libelous. If so then previous comments about the athletic director could also be considered libel. Isn't the point of an open forum to bring all ideas and perspectives to the table? Are we not permitted to discuss events and happenings within our community, especially when they are pertinent to the education of our children?
I refuse to be a part of a repressive and nearly fascist forum that does not allow for the transmission of thoughts, ideas, and especially questions that are counter to that of others.
"I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
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Apr 4, 2012
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60lbsl8r
Joined: Dec 19, 2011
Posts: 36
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I heard that the meeting went well last night. I hope that the board members and whoever's in charge has the courage to stand up for what the kids and community want and not what the man in the suit wants.
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Apr 4, 2012
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newschoolranger
Joined: Sep 8, 2010
Posts: 678
Location: Dayton, Ohio |
SectionVAlum wrote:Very well put. After rereading my first posts I should have never used the word "fact" but instead stuck with observations and for this I apologize. However, people are in turn providing observations and opinions. The matter remains that a teacher was passed over three times while holding a part time position, which is an observation that must be considered in this instance as it can provide insight into the possible reasoning for Mr. D'Ambra's dismissal as coach. I am confused how bringing up actual observations and happenings is libelous. If so then previous comments about the athletic director could also be considered libel. Isn't the point of an open forum to bring all ideas and perspectives to the table? Are we not permitted to discuss events and happenings within our community, especially when they are pertinent to the education of our children?
I refuse to be a part of a repressive and nearly fascist forum that does not allow for the transmission of thoughts, ideas, and especially questions that are counter to that of others.
"I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
Bro, it's a little late for the retraction. You came on a public forum, a pretty intelligent one, I might add, and attacked a guy's credibility. What did you expect?
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Apr 4, 2012
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vanwilder141
Joined: Oct 12, 2005
Posts: 274
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I'm a history buff as well, kudos to you. Where we disagree again is your flawed rational. When comparing the members of this forums to Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, and Hussein it's difficult to draw on any correlation. Your quote is Voltaire, again I love it!!!!
Here's my favorite:
"He is a hard man who is only just, and a sad one who is only wise". -Voltaire
Last edited by vanwilder141 on Apr 5, 2012; edited 1 time in total
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Apr 4, 2012
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newschoolranger
Joined: Sep 8, 2010
Posts: 678
Location: Dayton, Ohio |
My favorite quote:
"Never rat on your friends, and always keep your mouth shut." Tommy
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Apr 4, 2012
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SectionVAlum
Joined: Apr 3, 2012
Posts: 8
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I did not attack his credibility. I simply pointed out information and observations. We are allowed to think for ourselves and develop our own conclusions. You may conclude whatever you wish.
Failing to allow the free expression of ideas is fascist. The topic of the forum was on the Spencerport coaching change and that is what I have addressed. Attacking me for what I say concerning that topic detracts from the actual conversation.
I am done here. I can see where I am not wanted. Best of luck to everyone - I hope this situation works out for the best interest of the students.
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Apr 4, 2012
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QUIET
Joined: Jan 9, 2005
Posts: 735
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SectionVAlum wrote:Very well put. After rereading my first posts I should have never used the word "fact" but instead stuck with observations and for this I apologize. However, people are in turn providing observations and opinions. The matter remains that a teacher was passed over three times while holding a part time position, which is an observation that must be considered in this instance as it can provide insight into the possible reasoning for Mr. D'Ambra's dismissal as coach. I am confused how bringing up actual observations and happenings is libelous. If so then previous comments about the athletic director could also be considered libel. Isn't the point of an open forum to bring all ideas and perspectives to the table? Are we not permitted to discuss events and happenings within our community, especially when they are pertinent to the education of our children?
I refuse to be a part of a repressive and nearly fascist forum that does not allow for the transmission of thoughts, ideas, and especially questions that are counter to that of others.
"I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
Beep, beep, beep - that's the sound of a truck backing up - which you have done at least twice since your original post.
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Apr 4, 2012
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newschoolranger
Joined: Sep 8, 2010
Posts: 678
Location: Dayton, Ohio |
SectionVAlum wrote:I did not attack his credibility. I simply pointed out information and observations. We are allowed to think for ourselves and develop our own conclusions. You may conclude whatever you wish.
Failing to allow the free expression of ideas is fascist. The topic of the forum was on the Spencerport coaching change and that is what I have addressed. Attacking me for what I say concerning that topic detracts from the actual conversation.
I am done here. I can see where I am not wanted. Best of luck to everyone - I hope this situation works out for the best interest of the students.
Good luck in your pursuit of an admin. position.
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