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We need numbers


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
So on my local website we constantly "complain" about how Fios and cable don't cover our high school events, well now we have someone rolling the dice on us. ESPN is increasing its coverage of the NCAA tournament. What we chose to do with this is up to us.

http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/17976


132nomore
Joined: Jan 3, 2015
Posts: 32
Well said Rob


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
Thanks for keeping post "fresh" maybe we can make a difference


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 840
DEVIL's ADVOCATE.

Unfortunately, this Sport will be the first abandonment of most HS Admins.

Here is what has been lost. Back in the early '60s. Wrestling was viewed by the High School classes- Soph/Junior/ Sen...by alumni , by teachers, and parents. Same in the '70s. The school spirit was maintained into the '80s. Then with an impact unfathomable to the Wrestling followers it became more cultish . Yes, those who still were involved maintained- those who followed continued to follow...yet, most of the school participation/ school spirit was gone. The alumni was gone- the school Admin if, not being paid were gone. Now, after two decades of spiraling downward. It is not even a blemish of what was once seen- Today, contact sports in many areas of New York State are viewed as "unnecessary "....too violent...w/too much liability and without much of a following.

To bring this Sport back. You would have to convince the Parent that contact sports are of value. You would have to push the school teachers and admin to get involved . This would mean that they would carry a flag for a sport that they have NO interest in. You would have to make students attend wrestling matches...and how would you be able to do this ??? lol. The sport of wrestling imo will become a club sport. There is a very limited future for NYS Wrestling. The old gurus are almost gone and the newbees arent even of the same mold.

ENJOY WHAT'S LEFT.


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
Marty, I love the wealth of knowledge you bring to the table. I respect all that you have done for the sport before I knew what a high crotch was, but the endless doomsday beating of your drum has to stop. Even you have to see that it produces nothing. If you offered one solution for every two problems you state I would say continue, but as they say if you are not part of the solution then you are part of the problem... everyone has a part in the solution, and the solution is simple introduce a friend to what we love. Everyone who loves athletics that I know when I explain the sport to them ends up liking it. Elitism is the enemy of our sport getting mass appeal is our salvation . Just yesterday I showed a middle school mom why wrestling is safer then her beloved baseball. I sat with her explained what her son was attempting to do (it is middle school lol), and by the end she was cheering. I disagree with a friend of mine who is a youth USA state rep regarding coaching kids (he wants to charge exorbitant amounts to get a coaches pass to limit the number of people on mats), what he ends up doing is turning people away at an early age and that is something we cannot have. Finallly I object to your negativity. Your knowledge base is something we need (I would never have banned you from LI site, webmaster is a friend and while I disagree with you I think your thoughts deserve discussion), but even you have to see you are turning off people. Let's say you are right and our better days are behind us, what does saying it day in and day out do? What is your goal? How about you think about a positive way of bringing us "unwashed" and unorthodox folks up to speed rather then standing on your soap box and screaming the "sky is falling" every other day? I would love to learn from you and others if the end is teaching the youth about our past to strengthen our future. You sir are not doing that, and I respectfully ask for your help for the future of what we both hold dear. Wrestling!


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 840
bigkidsdad,

I am a wrestling drop-out. I was known as the JV Quitter- I put myself out there not hiding behind titles, medals or size of my manhood. I started wrestling in 1963-64. I followed my older brother's lead. Actually, he was a dominant wrestler back in the early '60s. He became an Official and a Coach in his late years- will be inducted into the National Wrestling HOF this year and was honored at this past NYS Tourney. Point is- I was a participant with good lineage and ability. My wrestling career was ten yrs ending as a sophmore in HS. When I went to HS practice- plastic suits, sweats, and puddles of water were common . The room was above 80- and drilling was intense. So, intense that knowing I would have to lose nearly 20 lbs every 3rd day - it made the sport less desirable to me. Especially, when I could field a ground ball and carry a football to success.

Here is what you are missing in my interpretation of what is going on in this sport...or not going on. There are so many breakdowns in HSs all across America. In NYS , the Admins/ Budgets/ the introduction of immigrants and the services provided to them have all been under scrutiny. All have drained the well . All come first before athletics. Makes perfect sense that those who are trying to maintain have become obstructions to the larger picture of what is needed and what isnt...Unfortunately, the geeks are winning this war- the lack of finance will continue to breakdown the easiest links . Those are HS athletics and specifically CONTACT SPORTs.

So, while you see my post as DOOMSDAY retorts. I just choose to see things with clarity- and- without prejudice . I cant help the future results of what has already been going on for 20+ years. I tried along with others- when we were thoroughly involved. Lastly, turning off people ??? In the last ten yrs I brought back former stars of this sport back to the forefront of where they left off. I tried to promote this sport exclusively. The TRUTH is. This sport is a hard sale especially, to the unknowing. It is hard today to sell and maintain interest at every level. Not the right time- not the right climate. As I have said before you would have to "Go back to the Future". This would be the SALE of this Sport by the Gym teacher in the hallways- recruiting new wrestlers - It would also mean mandatory participation in the Gym class- and- the school body would have to get involved. Wrestlers love when girls follow their efforts on the mat. Marketing without money seems to be unheard of these days. SO, THE BOOSTER CLUB will be the primary focus. They, would have to go way beyond what they currently do.

Good luck to those who put the time in.


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
So for as long as I have been involved in wrestling you have been saying same thing. I suggest that if the outcome you desire has not yet been attained then logic would submit that a different course be taken by you if you wish to see a different outcome. If I get up and walk into the door and do that repeatedly and I am expecting a different result each time what does that make me? So what is there to lose by doing what I say? Lower yourself and attend a local middle school or JV match and help educate the parents of some kid who may never make the varsity line up. The worse that could happen is you waste your time, on the upside you may encourage a kid, maybe a younger brother, maybe a neighbor who likes what they see. I think coaches are important, I think participants (wrestlers) are paramount, but the forgotten x-factor is the fans. When I wanted to learn about wrestling most of the people weren't forgiving of my ignorance. Now that I am in the "adolescence" of my knowledge of wrestling, when I ask slightly more complicated questions (usually at the behest of friends who are scared to be shot down on a forum for their ignorance) I am still met by an arrogance by people who seem to get mad that a question is asked. People in this sport tend to like to talk to themselves or small groups of people who are like them. They do not like to have to explain themselves, nor do they wish to lower themselves to "promoting" what they do. I am a soccer guy. I appreciate a 90 minute match that ends in a 0-0 score, but I do realize that is boring to 99% of the world. As a soccer guy I am of the mindset that the goals should be bigger to make the sport higher scoring so the "masses" can appreciate the game, the purists hate the people on my side of the argument, difference between wrestling and soccer is that soccer has a world appeal. College rules in wrestling instituted last year have done wonders for keeping the action going and that is good for the sport. Taking a noobie to a Penn State match or watching one on TV with them would be a smart thing (I know you don't like the David Taylors of the world but just listen). Watching a low scoring Dean Heil match not so much.... Our sport has an aging demographic and whatever it takes to get people interested is good. I choose to think I can make a difference, if I am fooling myself I am not hurting anyone. Your position isn't much different, you have just become jaded and think because it cannot be like it was it might as well be gone, I disagree. I hope you understand that people like you have long coat tails and can be a positive force, I would just ask that you think about that when you post so that what you have to offer doesn't get blocked out by the direness of your message.


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 840
I THINK therefore I am.

My posts will always support interest of this sport. Any news is good news.

Sorry, this ship has sailed - and- it is not coming back. The FUTURE of this sport is now- so, enjoy it.

Jaded...??? lol. No, an educated eye is more precise. My prognostications are usually right.

EVERYTHING IS THERE....to change the current climate yet, Society/ Economics will not allow for it.

Wake me up again...when you see a HS kid driving a '77 Chevy that has dents in it or when he/she isnt carrying a cellphone. shake me if you see kids taking out the garbage . raking leaves and shoveling driveways Let me know when the Empty Ball Fields are full again- full with boys playing touch/tackle football or pick-up baseball games. When you see this..........(imo NEVER AGAIN).....WHEN you see this...please, let me know. Though, I think you will have to reach me when Im six feet under and the ashes have crumbled to the bottom of the casket.


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
You win! Against my better judgment I entered into the Kobeashi Maru test. Only Kirk was able to beat it, I failed.


subway101
Joined: Jan 17, 2013
Posts: 57
bigkidsdad wrote:
You win! Against my better judgment I entered into the Kobeashi Maru test. Only Kirk was able to beat it, I failed.


If you look at Marty's login info he has posted 820 times. 819 were the same. It was a valiant effort by you!!


132nomore
Joined: Jan 3, 2015
Posts: 32
Who knows what the future holds
But for now
Tune into ESPN (36) and enjoy the action


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
The coverage is outstanding! I am sure however, twenty years ago it was better lol.


Livinginthepast
Joined: Feb 17, 2016
Posts: 38
I'm going to enjoy the coverage and relish the weekend! Doom and gloom can wait until Monday morning...


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 840
Actually, the coverage sucks in Round 1 n 2. Grateful, that they have wrestling on TV BUT, it is ridiculous to make Baldwin the face of wrestling- too much talk- too much bs about Team races (every year) and not enough viewing of the matches Too much focus on the #1 seeds- w/ blow out scores. Just not enough viewing of matches. They had the camera on a pigtail match- when 125 was starting the second round.

It does get better with the semis/ split screens.

One thumb up- not -two thumbs up .
...............

Props to Piccininni, Palacio, Realbutto going into the "death valley" round.


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 51
All mats are streamed on ESPN.com, don't know what more you can ask for. Live coverage on national broadcast tv, and every match streamed, you are truly a contrarian just for effect. Should they contact you for which matches to cover on ESPN-U? This is my point about the "problems" with the old guard of wrestling. Anything they do that strays from your version of orthodoxy is not good. They are appealing to the masses of people who don't wrestle, you are too blind to see that is a good thing yet you claim to always do what is best for the sport. Next you will retort with an oblique response that says nothing but takes 500 words to say. Truth is you probably didn't know it was streamed but you can't admit a mistake, lol. In retail we would say "damaged goods".
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