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Pick the upset(s)- NCAA DI Nationals


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 166
I am one of those who "roar" at food deprivation. The very best wrestlers do not have to "cut" but manage their weight (just about all of the Penn state wrestlers and many more I can mention). While I have no problem with weight cutting in college when bodies are pretty much formed I do have an issue with kids whose bodies aren't formed yet depriving their bodies of nutrition. Anyhow that's a different subject. The weight classes in college to me seem to need a tweaking (if only to be more in line with international weights). It may be time to consider a 11th weight class at the collegiate level, and maybe starting at 118 again (maybe moving 197 to 215 or so, and stretching some of the classes at upper weights)


coachlaz
Joined: Mar 4, 2015
Posts: 35
LImarty wrote:
WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONs in NYS have helped this Sport.... 00's Parents now again can live with contact sports yet, roar at food deprivation . Kids like not missing any meals. ALL GOOD. Took me time to get over this. Mainly, because I believe a wrestler can remain healthy one weight below certification. I don't want to defend my position. In general New Jersey/ PA wrestlers know how to maintain their weight and do not have to be asked or told -what to do. So, at many National events- seems like New York wrestlers are always undersized. Just an observation. I remember some NYS Champs who went on to DI - that imo would have AA'd or had better shots at becoming National Champs- if, they had learn how to cut/ committed to managing their weight. Steven Dutton comes to mind- always, thought he should have been a College 133 lber. I remember Nick Terdick wrestling at 152 lbs in VA Beach and he by far was the smallest 152 lber in the weight class.

How Lizak makes 125 lbs is a mystery. Small 125 lbers such as Suriano, Piccininni, and others have to be TECHNICALLY ON POINT- when facing wrestlers who are dramatically bigger after weigh -ins or by finals..Such as Lizak and Tomasello.


Dake was a NY wrestler that never sucked a ton of weight. In fact, he went up a weight class to make history his 4th title. Kind of shoots a hole in that take, being he's arguably the most successful D1 wrestler of all time.


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
hmmm ??

STYMIED for a moment. Feel, like Al Pacino in Godfather 3. "...drag me back in".

I hate this subject for one reason. I know many wrestlers who lost 20 lbs between a Tuesday and a Friday match. With that being said.. I have a difference of opinion on what is healthy and/or not. Watching wrestlers come to a Tourney with an Igloo ...isn't what I remember as being healthy either. DESIRE, DEDICATION and DISCIPLINE. My opinion , makes me feel that a wrestler should know that he has to DEDICATE his attention toward skill and he should DISCIPLINE his food/ drink intake during the season if, he DESIREs to be the best. Most today- seem to go the route of "chill".

PA wrestlers "suck" weight from the time they are 13/ 14....Want to call it manage....?? ok....lol. COMPETITION does this.

On the Dake comment. Kyle had to REALLY , REALLY, manage his weight in HS...to make 112 it was not easy...and as 130 lber was no joke either. His defensive stinginess was his gift- his counters was his weapon and for the most part offensively he was common. While he grew in College - imo he was just dramatically competitive and didn't like to give up anything. Rarely, any freebees...that is a COMPETITIVE EDGE which is internal....which is not taught.

I relished all his wins over David Taylor. Cause, I believed he was better than Taylor back in High School....thanks DAKE, DAKE....DAKE !!!

but, the TAKEDOWN still wins matches and Jordan Burroughs has owned Dake - just for that reason. As far as Piccinnini goes probably as talented as anyone in the field other than Suriano yet, his size does leave him at a physical disadvantage. JMO - Yianni is a winner- if, it isn't this year- it will be soon.


BULL80
Joined: Nov 30, 2016
Posts: 57
coachlaz wrote:
LImarty wrote:
WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONs in NYS have helped this Sport.... 00's Parents now again can live with contact sports yet, roar at food deprivation . Kids like not missing any meals. ALL GOOD. Took me time to get over this. Mainly, because I believe a wrestler can remain healthy one weight below certification. I don't want to defend my position. In general New Jersey/ PA wrestlers know how to maintain their weight and do not have to be asked or told -what to do. So, at many National events- seems like New York wrestlers are always undersized. Just an observation. I remember some NYS Champs who went on to DI - that imo would have AA'd or had better shots at becoming National Champs- if, they had learn how to cut/ committed to managing their weight. Steven Dutton comes to mind- always, thought he should have been a College 133 lber. I remember Nick Terdick wrestling at 152 lbs in VA Beach and he by far was the smallest 152 lber in the weight class.

How Lizak makes 125 lbs is a mystery. Small 125 lbers such as Suriano, Piccininni, and others have to be TECHNICALLY ON POINT- when facing wrestlers who are dramatically bigger after weigh -ins or by finals..Such as Lizak and Tomasello.


Dake was a NY wrestler that never sucked a ton of weight. In fact, he went up a weight class to make history his 4th title. Kind of shoots a hole in that take, being he's arguably the most successful D1 wrestler of all time.



I think you are wrong on Dake he didn't cut often for HS perhaps, but Koll is on record his senior year saying that his Senior year was the first time he spent more time on the mat than the bike....


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
Dake was disciplined-and dedicated to the sport. Good genetics, good work habits.....this was the norm for many before him and remains to be the norm for those who desire to be champions.

Dake went from 112 lbs to 130 lbs in one year. Most have spurts of one or a two weight class jump the following year. So, I would assume that he had to work at making 112lb...and his jump to 141 in College as a frosh- makes me think .....that he struggled a little with weight.


Falcs96
Joined: Jan 21, 2015
Posts: 597
Oh, right. David Taylor!!!! That was another beauty of yours. He wasnt going to cut it at Penn State either, accordng to you. You really are a master of side-stepping all your self-professed expert opinions. Picc, DT, Yianni, etc.

Apparently, the key to D1 success is receiving the seal of disapproval from you!😂

Last edited by Falcs96 on Mar 14, 2018; edited 2 times in total


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 166
He wasn't going to succeed internationally either. Lol those Russians at the Yarigan are soft, and weak.


duddems
Joined: Jan 25, 2018
Posts: 139
[quote="Heisenberg"]Tomasello will probably weigh 141 by Saturday night ![/qu

140 cuz hes juiced outta his gord. Someone like Lizak is a much bigger frame by nature. Natos juiced up body is a double edged sword...hes way strong for the weight, but endurance and flexibility are compromised. Hes just so damn tough on top of strong and positionally and technically sound. I might sway my 125 pick his way.


duddems
Joined: Jan 25, 2018
Posts: 139
bigkidsdad wrote:
He wasn't going to succeed internationally either. Lol those Russians at the Yarigan are soft, and weak.


Marty has been way iff on many...david taylor and yanni are prime examples. Id like to hear his comments on yanni now after yannis freshman season, which was awesome, one loss getting turned last second, and hopefully🤞a ncaa title in it's very toughest weight class. Marty, you have knowledge and experience...but sometimes ur flat wrong. No worries, happens to the best.


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
You BOZO's keep blasting me on .....nonsense.

David Taylor was over hyped IMO....while Dake was under the radar. That was my contention. The FLO boyz always boasting to me about Taylor and I kept them from the helium that they were ingesting ..with my Kyle Dake claims. So, who was right ??? Dake beat Taylor how many times ?? Dake won 4 NCAA titles at - 4 different weights which will probably never be done again. Yeah, I was wrong - I said 2 titles and 3 appearances ...lol. While you buffoons weren't saying anything AND the rankings guys had him ranked 6th or 7th Nationally his HS senior year.

You guys are loons....I read the clippings on Taylor "the golden boy"...when he was a soph in High School. Same for Palmer..and their Ohio contingent . Funny, how Palmer was entered in Va Beach- same weight as Dake and was a "no show". A Fla kid named Metellus (sp) and a NJ kid named Silvestri really made Dake work for his junior title....How dedicated was Dake ?? Beat a Arizona or New Mexico 5 X State Champ as a senior got on a plane flew to Vegas the same week and finished 4th in National FS Tourney.

Only thing that I questioned about Yianni- is he wasn't too offensive in neutral...seemed he counters more than he attacks. Havent seen him this year and I don't know too much about 141 this weekend. I can see that he has handled DI quite well and in the Cornell Room he will only finesse his talent.

Why don't you tell me about Carl Adams ?? "Sports Illuststrated middle weight of the decade"...a decade is 10 yrs..right ??? Any feelings on Nate Carr ?? Think he would beat Yianni ??? or maybe, Kenny Monday...how would he do against Kyle Dake. ??? You guys - I put in my hip pocket. You amuse me.


Falcs96
Joined: Jan 21, 2015
Posts: 597
Dake was indeed under the radar. But Taylor was NEVER over-hyped. And Dake being ranked 6th or 7th nationally wasn't an oversight. That's about where he merited a HS ranking. He wasn't Retherford or Stieber entering college.......and he wasnt Yianni either!! Its the work he put in after graduating HS that seperated him from the pack!


Heisenberg
Joined: Nov 30, 2016
Posts: 157
Location: WNY
I’ve only seen 4 of Yianni’s matches this year( including Meredith and Eierman), but he seems to attack quite abit to me. I’ve never seen a guy get so extended out when hes in on a leg, yet come out with the TD. I expect to see him on top of the podium Saturday night.
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Falcs96
Joined: Jan 21, 2015
Posts: 597
It would not surprise me one bit to see that.


duddems
Joined: Jan 25, 2018
Posts: 139
LImarty wrote:
You BOZO's keep blasting me on .....nonsense.

David Taylor was over hyped IMO....while Dake was under the radar. That was my contention. The FLO boyz always boasting to me about Taylor and I kept them from the helium that they were ingesting ..with my Kyle Dake claims. So, who was right ??? Dake beat Taylor how many times ?? Dake won 4 NCAA titles at - 4 different weights which will probably never be done again. Yeah, I was wrong - I said 2 titles and 3 appearances ...lol. While you buffoons weren't saying anything AND the rankings guys had him ranked 6th or 7th Nationally his HS senior year.

You guys are loons....I read the clippings on Taylor "the golden boy"...when he was a soph in High School. Same for Palmer..and their Ohio contingent . Funny, how Palmer was entered in Va Beach- same weight as Dake and was a "no show". A Fla kid named Metellus (sp) and a NJ kid named Silvestri really made Dake work for his junior title....How dedicated was Dake ?? Beat a Arizona or New Mexico 5 X State Champ as a senior got on a plane flew to Vegas the same week and finished 4th in National FS Tourney.

Only thing that I questioned about Yianni- is he wasn't too offensive in neutral...seemed he counters more than he attacks. Havent seen him this year and I don't know too much about 141 this weekend. I can see that he has handled DI quite well and in the Cornell Room he will only finesse his talent.

Why don't you tell me about Carl Adams ?? "Sports Illuststrated middle weight of the decade"...a decade is 10 yrs..right ??? Any feelings on Nate Carr ?? Think he would beat Yianni ??? or maybe, Kenny Monday...how would he do against Kyle Dake. ??? You guys - I put in my hip pocket. You amuse me.


Yanii shoots plenty of a wide variety of attacks very successfully


duddems
Joined: Jan 25, 2018
Posts: 139
[quote="Falcs96"]Dake was indeed under the radar. But Taylor was NEVER over-hyped. And Dake being ranked 6th or 7th nationally wasn't an oversight. That's about where he merited a HS ranking. He wasn't Retherford or Stieber entering college.......and he wasnt Yianni either!! Its the work he put in after graduating HS that seperated him from the pack![/quote

Agreed. Heck, a section V stud named Ian Paddock handled Dake in the states. Ian was very very good (obviosly 3x) and ithink if he had been able to stay physically healthy he wouldve do e even more at Ohio St...where he did have some legit success.
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