Old School - View previous topic | View next topic


Page 1 of 4
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Old School -


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 924
After watching the NCAAs this past weekend again, it put a smile/ smirk / grin to watch how both old school and nu skol situations all get resolved on the mat. I watched a freshmen like Spencer Lee not letting anyone near his legs and not allowing a takedown the whole Tourney which was totally old school to me. All the flash, scrambles, hi Cs, and funk meant absolutely nothing to this well prepared savvy freshmen. He made Suriano look like a JV kid. I watched an unseeded beast at 197lbs/ Conel - just muscle the #1 seed to his back for a fall.,.damn, that was nice !!! Wasn't it Yianni who locked up a desperation cradle to win a NCAA title. ???

So, let me be clear. A solid defense -in neutral...a throw...a cradle. Hmmm ??? Old school.

JMO- the "leg attacks" that I viewed this past week had ONE major flaw from these Nu Skol gladiators .....straight on attacks are usually fruitless without a perfect set-up. Creating angles allows you to bring your opponents leg closer to your attack. Drags, passing the arm, head pressure, circling - creates angles- Then again, what do I know I am a JV quitter.


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 138
Well how convenient that these fine wrestlers are becoming favorites of yours now that they are champs. Yanni has been wrestling like that since 7th grade (I don't remember kind words from you regarding him or his friend and teammate Vito). He is as much Ben Askren as he is old school I don't know how you can lay claim to his style being old school. IMar is clearly a guy who wrestles in the "Marty" style, and I don't see that grind in Spencer Lee either. IMar and other old school wrestlers would rather grind on top not score (maybe pin, but not turning for points). Spencer would sooner TF you if he gets on top. Nice to pick winners though after the fact. I'm betting you like the Eagles now too? And I bet that Snyder kid might do well at the 2018 Yarigan. Just joking with you, I'm glad you finally see what we have all been telling you for years, wrestling is just getting better. Can't wait till next year when you discover Dayton Fixx and proclaim him "old skool" too, lol. Glad you are showing the capacity to grow, learn, and expand....


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 924
THEY call you a BLOWHARD on LIWA.....I can see why.

If, you think it is better....better than what ?? I suggest you go watch some video of the late 70s, and 80s...IT is a different game today- better rules for viewing.

Yianni did originally come from PA...right ??? lol.

Put this in your pipe...as High School seniors. Matt Sganga would have torched Nick Piccininni.....Sganga lost to Pat Flynn 6-2. Sganga also, lost to Mitchell of Freeport 15-2. Mitchell never won a Section title. BETTER ?????? LOL !!!


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 138
So what side of your mouth are you speaking from today. Are you in or out on their dominance, hard to tell. Can't claim either kid is old school. You might be able to say they are in a class by themselves, but that is not what your post says. Simple solution mean what you say, say what you mean and no one will call you out least of all me. Your hypocrisy is undaunted, your name dropping boundless. You don't need to bash Picininni to extol Sganga. Your trying somehow to validate your comments by tying success of great kids to what you say here, I just continue to point it out. There is no link between what virtues you extol and these two freshmen, period, end of story. If you wante to say you were wrong these past few years on Yanni, well we would all listen, but your not. You are doubling down and trying to bend facts to your reality. So now I'm a "blowhard", last week I was a "douche", and week before I was "fatkidsdad", all that time you were and continue to be wrong and out dated. Sorry, truth hurts.


duddems
Joined: Jan 25, 2018
Posts: 135
Spencer Lee was a monster from nuetral and top but check this...spencer lost to desanto in his last high school match w a bum knee...Yanni just blew through 3 strait monsters on way to a title eith a torn ACL. Put that in ur pipe n smoke it.


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 924
bigkids-type2,

WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONs is your only argument. Here is why ?? Prior to weight certifications we had juniors and seniors wrestling 98 lbs. Today, the majority are either 9th grader or younger. In the mid -70s you had JVs and Junior High Teams with wrestle-offs. Need more FACTs. New York was equal to PA / Iowa and NJ could carry our ball bag. MORE Facts ??? Olympians came from New York , alternates too...all during a time when going to College was not the most important thing. This went on through the late 80s...and then it happened Wrestling was still very competitive through-out the state until...WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONS. Lower numbers- lost programs- no JVs for most and middle school wrestlers were lost by the time they made it up to the High School....More FACTs...Parents such as yourself found a new avenue one that has you intruding on the Coach and the Administration actually, became a fungus....society became softer and these newbees became unfriendly to contact sports.

Now, lets say I'm WRONG (I'm not) Let's use Football as the example. Can you tell me about all the DI scholarships at present or all the ALL PRO athletes from our region (Long Island) ??? FACT IS : the list of ALL TIME GREATS- All stars in PRO Sports comes primarily prior to 1990. So, if we use this as a barometer of contact sports even the blind squirrel could/can see that you are NUTs. Back to wrestling. While I still have love for the sport - I can tell you first hand that many of these TOP wrestlers are not schooled in all positions- At the High School level in New York it has fallen imo to a level we haven't seen since the 1950s...and even then there were High School aged wrestlers who would dominate.

Last FACT. Pennsylvania had 53 entrants to the DI NCAA Tournament - New York had 12 or 13. This is how far we have fallen. With all due respect to wrestlers. From what I watched at this year's NYS Tournament. If, I was asked who would I recommend to a DI Coach... I would say: "Look elsewhere". Sorry, for telling it like it is. A rebirth of toughness must be implemented... very few Coaches are pushing this practice for various reasons.

DESIRE, DEDICATION , DISCIPLINE. Without all three you have middle of the road wrestling. COMPETITION- it's blood and guts in PA from the age of 6 through high school- same for many areas outside of New York. Being HUNGRY- is not about eating.


Heisenberg
Joined: Nov 30, 2016
Posts: 112
Location: WNY
I saw alot of guys at States who Id love to see on our local D1 team, UB (Buffalo). Busiello, Greg D, Teemer, Gissendanner, Barnes, Coumo , to name a few.

Now if your on Cael or Tom Ryans speed dial, sure , the list shortens. But D1 covers a broad spectrum.
_________________
" Who are you talking to right now ? .... Who is it you think you see ? "


duddems
Joined: Jan 25, 2018
Posts: 135
Heisenberg wrote:
I saw alot of guys at States who Id love to see on our local D1 team, UB (Buffalo). Busiello, Greg D, Teemer, Gissendanner, Barnes, Coumo , to name a few.

Now if your on Cael or Tom Ryans speed dial, sure , the list shortens. But D1 covers a broad spectrum.


Exactly. There were a handfull of D1 wrestlers at the state tourn.dont forget Teemer, O Anderson to name a few that havent been mentioned...but theres more.


quickpick
Joined: Jan 9, 2015
Posts: 191
LImarty wrote:
bigkids-type2,

WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONs is your only argument. Here is why ?? Prior to weight certifications we had juniors and seniors wrestling 98 lbs. Today, the majority are either 9th grader or younger. In the mid -70s you had JVs and Junior High Teams with wrestle-offs. Need more FACTs. New York was equal to PA / Iowa and NJ could carry our ball bag. MORE Facts ??? Olympians came from New York , alternates too...all during a time when going to College was not the most important thing. This went on through the late 80s...and then it happened Wrestling was still very competitive through-out the state until...WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONS. Lower numbers- lost programs- no JVs for most and middle school wrestlers were lost by the time they made it up to the High School....More FACTs...Parents such as yourself found a new avenue one that has you intruding on the Coach and the Administration actually, became a fungus....society became softer and these newbees became unfriendly to contact sports.

Now, lets say I'm WRONG (I'm not) Let's use Football as the example. Can you tell me about all the DI scholarships at present or all the ALL PRO athletes from our region (Long Island) ??? FACT IS : the list of ALL TIME GREATS- All stars in PRO Sports comes primarily prior to 1990. So, if we use this as a barometer of contact sports even the blind squirrel could/can see that you are NUTs. Back to wrestling. While I still have love for the sport - I can tell you first hand that many of these TOP wrestlers are not schooled in all positions- At the High School level in New York it has fallen imo to a level we haven't seen since the 1950s...and even then there were High School aged wrestlers who would dominate.

Last FACT. Pennsylvania had 53 entrants to the DI NCAA Tournament - New York had 12 or 13. This is how far we have fallen. With all due respect to wrestlers. From what I watched at this year's NYS Tournament. If, I was asked who would I recommend to a DI Coach... I would say: "Look elsewhere". Sorry, for telling it like it is. A rebirth of toughness must be implemented... very few Coaches are pushing this practice for various reasons.

DESIRE, DEDICATION , DISCIPLINE. Without all three you have middle of the road wrestling. COMPETITION- it's blood and guts in PA from the age of 6 through high school- same for many areas outside of New York. Being HUNGRY- is not about eating.


Wouldn't a senior 98lber turn into a small 125lber in college? That kid wouldn't want to see a 140lb NATO on day 3 of the tournament!


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 138
Marty you are all over the place I almost don't know where to begin, but let's:

"WEIGHT CERTIFICATIONs is your only argument. Here is why ?? Prior to weight certifications we had juniors and seniors wrestling 98 lbs."

Where does that come from, my only problem on this forum is you bashing kids or like now using their names to claim that you either "predicted the success" because they followed the "Marty Formula of Wrestling", or to name drop to claim somehow you had a part of their success. I can agree to disagree with facts, well thought out arguments, and maybe learn something if you are logical and persistent and intelligent in your posts. You are none of the above.


"More FACTs...Parents such as yourself found a new avenue one that has you intruding on the Coach and the Administration actually, became a fungus....society became softer and these newbees became unfriendly to contact sports."

Grasping at straws baby. My kids are what they are, neither exceptional nor bad wrestlers, good kids all. Trying to bait me through them shows that you are at a lower level of low then that of pond scum. Bring on any school official that has had me argue with them on behalf of my children. I have had two sets of wrestling coaches and two AD's just for wrestling (my kids play sports in all seasons) and I barely speak to the coaches in wrestling season (or other coaches during the seasons their sports occur). I never speak to them about my kids unless they come to me, but nice try....

"Now, lets say I'm WRONG (I'm not) Let's use Football as the example. Can you tell me about all the DI scholarships at present or all the ALL PRO athletes from our region (Long Island) ??? FACT IS : the list of ALL TIME GREATS- All stars in PRO Sports comes primarily prior to 1990. So, if we use this as a barometer of contact sports even the blind squirrel could/can see that you are NUTs. Back to wrestling. While I still have love for the sport - I can tell you first hand that many of these TOP wrestlers are not schooled in all positions- At the High School level in New York it has fallen imo to a level we haven't seen since the 1950s...and even then there were High School aged wrestlers who would dominate."

Just when you I think you have shown me how stupid you can get, you break the stupid-meter. First to mention two things in a sentence does not show a cause and effect relationship as you might wish it does. Football is a poor example of your argument and bolsters mine more then you know. You think that clubs have hurt wrestling, where as I feel that they have enhanced it (changed it too, money is now a factor, and other things both good and bad). So without straining the few brain cells you have left, I will begin by saying that in states like Florida, Texas, Georgia, etc... football is year round, they join select clubs by their ability levels and kids who have a spark of talent fight to be in the best training situations. The talent pool didn't escape New Yorkers we are suffering from a deficit of training. In the 1960's and 1970's kids who were good at football were given scholarships and developed in college into good players, currently kids come into college with more experience at football at all levels, it is a huge business. At that time NFL linemen were averaging between 6'3" and 250ish pounds (normal weight without specific training). By the 1980's kids were starting to see the financial reward in being a pro athlete and size of players began to improve slightly (mostly through genetics but at the pro level "juicing" was becoming common place). In the 1980's the average linemen was 6'4" 272lbs. by the 1990's the cat was out of the bag and kids were juicing in college and before that. The need for specializing at an early age was apparent to get you kids a look, and parents and kids were doing anything to get that look. Now the numbers start to soar in the NFL by 1990 a lineman was averaging 6'4" 300lbs, in 2000 6'4" 313lbs, now in 2010's 6'5' 310 is an average. You can see where I got my info here: http://www.businessinsider.com/nfl-50s-tim-tebow-would-have-been-an-offensive-lineman-2011-10#2000s-jermon-bushrod-t-new-orleans-saints-9 and that is how a fact becomes a fact moron, not because I say it but because it is in print by others. Now you can argue a fact with other facts, but your facts are opinion. Maybe you cannot comprehend that.

Last FACT. Pennsylvania had 53 entrants to the DI NCAA Tournament - New York had 12 or 13. This is how far we have fallen. With all due respect to wrestlers. From what I watched at this year's NYS Tournament. If, I was asked who would I recommend to a DI Coach... I would say: "Look elsewhere". Sorry, for telling it like it is. A rebirth of toughness must be implemented... very few Coaches are pushing this practice for various reasons.

I have addressed this with you last year when you left this forum with your tail between your legs for months. Go back to the thread "we need numbers" where you took a thread about one thing and turned it into one of your insipid rants. It was there that I disputed your claims on NY dominance with facts and I sourced my information. I will not do it again as you ask others countless times to look things up but disregard facts that do not fit in with your simple minded solutions. I will gladly banter with you on this topic if you wish when you acknowledge simple facts as facts, and that begins with your assertions being wrong from the beginning.

Finally while we could agree on many things, (I like IMars wrestling and before the championship I would have bet the house on him winning) you seem to want to make your arguments by putting down someone else's. Countless times people were speaking of Yanni, Vito, Piccininni, Adam Busiello, Jacori, Frankie Giss and high school examples of excellence right now and you would take the time to explain how these kids were sub standard for years (and not in a manner which extols what you are saying but by putting down the kids of today as weak and some insipid diatribe). Now you come on here and start a thread on how Yanni is old school (implying that you were behind him for years!) and you expect me or anyone else isn't going to call you out you are more stupid then even I think. Even in your third reply in this thread you are bashing Piccinini (who just recently you were extoling because you thought he would AA again this year before the NCAA tournament) with his high school volunteer assistant Matt Sganga. I know these people personally and they would not appreciate you speaking of them in such a way yet you do regularly. Coach Matt is a great trainer, Nick P is a great college wrestler who fell short this year, you are a loser for trying to illicit a response from me by dropping their names in your usual salacious manner.

Sorry Martin the more you post the more you seem like a bitter old washed up loser who wants to be relevant but is not. Prove me wrong and change your ways and I will not come on here to correct the record every time you say something salacious.

Rob Araneo


johnnyrooster
Joined: Nov 28, 2008
Posts: 1092
Location: Hen House
Checkmate!!! Well done!!
Thanks "dad"! But somehow, some way , we know Martin will find a way to ignore your facts and spin your post as if he wrote it!


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 924
LOL. Left with my tail between my legs ....??? TOO FUNNY !!!. I do not kiss Steve Meehan's assets. His Forum was ALIVE when I posted. Just like everyone's Forum when LImarty posts. Secondly, Scott Arnel gave that cream filled donut too much authority. Their loss- not mine.

Look, I am being honest in my opinion. NONE of the NYS Champs in 2018 will make a dent in DI. Would be better off served going JUCO -DIII..

btw. EACH YEAR NYS's number of AAs will be on a decline- You can keep waving the flag but, I will implore you to take your head out of your butt hole. Lastly, as far as mentioning NAMEs- lol....when I compare athletes - this is only an educated opinion that actually presents them as being well thought of. Matt Sganga was as solid as they come yet, never won a Suffolk title- If, I had to choose between him and the past 10 yrs of Suffolk 112 lb champions- I would hands down take Sganga. Your vision will get clearer-

................................

quick,

ABSOLUTELY, that is why 118lbs- should be a weight class. How many 98/ 106 lbers seniors ever advance to the next level. I think ONE -a kid from Easton , PA- wrestled DI with limited results.

but, old 117, 123, and 132 DID bring NYS wrestlers to the forefront- when, weight certifications were not obstructions. My point is simplistic. The reason a NATO- Lizak- and others can make 125 lbs- is because they have been "cheating" weight certifications in H.S and know how to suck weight due to the level of competition....New York wrestlers bring Igloo lunch boxes to tournaments also, due to the lack of level of competition.

NYS today can not compete with top tier states for a multitude of reason but, more to do about age and weight- plus, the level of Coaching only goes so high.


quickpick
Joined: Jan 9, 2015
Posts: 191
LImarty wrote:
LOL. Left with my tail between my legs ....??? TOO FUNNY !!!. I do not kiss Steve Meehan's assets. His Forum was ALIVE when I posted. Just like everyone's Forum when LImarty posts. Secondly, Scott Arnel gave that cream filled donut too much authority. Their loss- not mine.

Look, I am being honest in my opinion. NONE of the NYS Champs in 2018 will make a dent in DI. Would be better off served going JUCO -DIII..

btw. EACH YEAR NYS's number of AAs will be on a decline- You can keep waving the flag but, I will implore you to take your head out of your butt hole. Lastly, as far as mentioning NAMEs- lol....when I compare athletes - this is only an educated opinion that actually presents them as being well thought of. Matt Sganga was as solid as they come yet, never won a Suffolk title- If, I had to choose between him and the past 10 yrs of Suffolk 112 lb champions- I would hands down take Sganga. Your vision will get clearer-

................................

quick,

ABSOLUTELY, that is why 118lbs- should be a weight class. How many 98/ 106 lbers seniors ever advance to the next level. I think ONE -a kid from Easton , PA- wrestled DI with limited results.

but, old 117, 123, and 132 DID bring NYS wrestlers to the forefront- when, weight certifications were not obstructions. My point is simplistic. The reason a NATO- Lizak- and others can make 125 lbs- is because they have been "cheating" weight certifications in H.S and know how to suck weight due to the level of competition....New York wrestlers bring Igloo lunch boxes to tournaments also, due to the lack of level of competition.

NYS today can not compete with top tier states for a multitude of reason but, more to do about age and weight- plus, the level of Coaching only goes so high.


I'd ask you to wager your posting rights on it, but you didn't follow through with the Imar deal.


bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 138
Marty, I don't know if it a reading comprehension issue, some unnamed disorder where about you are unable to read digest and respond to even your own comments, however not caring enough to diagnose your disorder I will try again.

The thread I refer to was here on matburn. I made no mention of your banning on LIWA. I have already disproved your constant wrangling about previous greatness in New York State wrestling. It was a year ago here on the thread "we need numbers". I was making a plea to readers to turn out in numbers for coverage for the NCAA's that year. You as usual took that as an invitation to corrupt the thread to your distorted views of the world. You asked me to "look it up"(as you ask everyone, because you are too lazy or too stupid to do it yourself), I did. I always assumed you knew what you were talking about up to that point, I was wrong. NY did not lose a substantial number of AA's over the years (there was a small drop that was more in alignment with other states becoming wrestling states then our demise). Anyhow "look it up", I laid it out for you. Maybe have someone read it to you, sorry this format doesn't allow for pictures or colored illustrations which might help with your attention deficit disorder. Sorry once again facts are facts and what you espouse is nonsense.


LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 924
Hey Araneo !!!

WTFs UP !!!! ????? With few exceptions- FEW- New York State wrestling is a shell of what it use to be. I go back to the 60s as a fan- and wrestled into the 70s. I was a peewee Coach through the 90s- Was very involved with MANY wrestlers who wrestled in the early 00s.

I will put it to you this way. Jon Masa, Anthony Riccardi, Mike Piccozzi, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc .etc......NEVER won a NYS Title yet, were DI recruits....and 2 were AAs. I have seen the BEST...and...what you are seeing is the REST.

go away !!! This sport in NYS has evolved into PEEWEE404....upper level peewees wrestling Varsity matches. The GOOD ONEs would/could fit at anytime- depending on if they knew how to cut 10-15 lbs each week- could sustain wrestle-offs and were willing to be drilled like plow horses. IMO they would not walk through a wrestling room door. I commend the boys who work their tails off- just far and few.

ps. There was wrestling in NY and GREAT NYS wrestlers prior to Yianni Diakomiholis...lol. About FACTs.....I REFERENCED PRO Athletes who grew up on Long Island. How many ALL- PRO players are coming from Long Island today ??? You're a JOKE...and that's a FACT !!!!

If, you need lists...in EVERY Sport -I will oblige you.


'''''''''''''''''''

quick,

I think you are referring to my "thinking" IMAR was unbeatable- a few years back (???)
Page 1 of 4
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum