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Jan 26, 2019
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tampacuse
Joined: Nov 2, 2011
Posts: 45
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(quickpick). You don't have to be a good/great wrestler to be a good coach. Coaching and judge talent can be learned. There are LOTS of coaches in all sports that weren't good at competing. I'm not taking the Islands side. 99% of the world can watch wrestling in the 60,70,80's and tell right away it's not as good as now.
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Jan 26, 2019
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quickpick
Joined: Jan 9, 2015
Posts: 284
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tampacuse wrote:(quickpick). You don't have to be a good/great wrestler to be a good coach. Coaching and judge talent can be learned. There are LOTS of coaches in all sports that weren't good at competing. I'm not taking the Islands side. 99% of the world can watch wrestling in the 60,70,80's and tell right away it's not as good as now.
I’m not saying you do. My point is before you criticize a kid for not being good, you might want to have finished out your high school career. This was also coming from the guy who claims that 90% of NYS high school coaches are not qualified to make wrestlers better. He shouldn’t be throwing stones....
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Jan 26, 2019
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LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
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tampacuse.
Some of the BEST HS Coaches in the past did not wrestle.....MOTIVAYION- REPETITION-DESIRE- DEDICATION-DISCIPLINE .....if, instilled in young men -can produce CHAMPIONs in any era. You are WRONG- about just generalizing decades. NYS wrestling has progressively declined in numbers since the 80s and the volume of talent has gone along the same line....special wrestlers can come at any time. I choose to believe....that the time has come and gone. I do not get inebriated by the STYLE of today's wrestlers. Today, it is much more prettier.
quick....WE'VE DANCED THIS DANCE BEFORE.
Having a contradicting opinion - and/or- different view of something is healthy. Many speak only about Tom Brady and Joe Montana.....well, if there was two minutes left in a Football game- I'd take John Elway or Dan Marino... and if, you wanted to see a skilled passer and runner you would love Roger Staubach. ...pure passers Len Dawson and Bob Greise . Ya see, WRESTLING and WRESTLERs have been around a long time and I have seen HS wrestlers get in plastic suits, hot boxes, carrying coffee cans....and then having to wrestle-off 3 Xs. This is coming from an ERA many of you- have absolutely " NO CLUE" about- A DIFFERENT HS ANIMAL...when 96 lbers were juniors and seniors...sucking 20 lbs in between matches. UNHEALTHY- yes...MENTAL TOUGHNESS- yes. A different animal with commitment to his peers/coach/family.
Ive watched the progression of Wrestling in NYS- from the 60s- into the 70s -at it's pinnacle late 70s- mid 80s....and the slow subtle decline through the late 90s, 00s, and to where we are now. I have a COMPETITIVE NATURE.....I was a three Sport athlete. I played two sports at a high level. I think I have a CLUE ...on what is good and what is better...and to your misfortune I do have a Wrestling background- which was intense as any- which stopped just earlier. WRESTLING today in New York State is not very good - compared to the last decade....and so on. To pick a kid here and there this is NOT a sign of strength . To name a handful - and- have Sections without a Finalist in decades- or never does not support ALL OF YOU BLOWHARDs too well..
BTW- A kid from ESM with a #1 HS ranking for past the two years will find it very hard to even wear a DI singlet....THIS ALONE TELLS ME WHAT CONDITION NYS HS WRESTLING CONDITION IS IN. I also question Dissenganner's and Teemers success at the DI level especially, without too much interest in riding.
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Jan 26, 2019
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ringworm2000
Joined: Jan 5, 2017
Posts: 83
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LImarty wrote:tampacuse.
Some of the BEST HS Coaches in the past did not wrestle.....MOTIVAYION- REPETITION-DESIRE- DEDICATION-DISCIPLINE .....if, instilled in young men -can produce CHAMPIONs in any era. You are WRONG- about just generalizing decades. NYS wrestling has progressively declined in numbers since the 80s and the volume of talent has gone along the same line....special wrestlers can come at any time. I choose to believe....that the time has come and gone. I do not get inebriated by the STYLE of today's wrestlers. Today, it is much more prettier.
quick....WE'VE DANCED THIS DANCE BEFORE.
Having a contradicting opinion - and/or- different view of something is healthy. Many speak only about Tom Brady and Joe Montana.....well, if there was two minutes left in a Football game- I'd take John Elway or Dan Marino... and if, you wanted to see a skilled passer and runner you would love Roger Staubach. ...pure passers Len Dawson and Bob Greise . Ya see, WRESTLING and WRESTLERs have been around a long time and I have seen HS wrestlers get in plastic suits, hot boxes, carrying coffee cans....and then having to wrestle-off 3 Xs. This is coming from an ERA many of you- have absolutely " NO CLUE" about- A DIFFERENT HS ANIMAL...when 96 lbers were juniors and seniors...sucking 20 lbs in between matches. UNHEALTHY- yes...MENTAL TOUGHNESS- yes. A different animal with commitment to his peers/coach/family.
Ive watched the progression of Wrestling in NYS- from the 60s- into the 70s -at it's pinnacle late 70s- mid 80s....and the slow subtle decline through the late 90s, 00s, and to where we are now. I have a COMPETITIVE NATURE.....I was a three Sport athlete. I played two sports at a high level. I think I have a CLUE ...on what is good and what is better...and to your misfortune I do have a Wrestling background- which was intense as any- which stopped just earlier. WRESTLING today in New York State is not very good - compared to the last decade....and so on. To pick a kid here and there this is NOT a sign of strength . To name a handful - and- have Sections without a Finalist in decades- or never does not support ALL OF YOU BLOWHARDs too well..
BTW- A kid from ESM with a #1 HS ranking for past the two years will find it very hard to even wear a DI singlet....THIS ALONE TELLS ME WHAT CONDITION NYS HS WRESTLING CONDITION IS IN. I also question Dissenganner's and Teemers success at the DI level especially, without too much interest in riding.
You make some points and then you lose your mind. The average wrestler of the past would destroy the average wrestler of today....but the top guys today are so much better. They train more, they work out more, they have private lessons, they travel and wrestle all off season. It is not even close and it is showing with the NY wrestlers success at the D1 level. Your out of your mind about Teemer....kid almost knocked off Kolodzik the #1 guy in the country during his redshirt year. Teemer will be a 3 to 4 time AA and compete for titles his junior and senior year.
Question Marty didn't you quit this post like 10 days ago......remember when you quit wrestling and never came back on the mat....please have that same dedication to this forum.
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Jan 26, 2019
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LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
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ringding,
What happened did it get too wet underneath that rock ???
This TRAINING MORE Is really funny. Do you actually know- HOW old school wrestlers trained ??? Huntington HS had a wrestler named Jeff Thomas....do you know that Jeff wrestled ALL year both Folk and FS. His father was a HS Coach at another HS. Jeff , after school- after practice- after homework- he would have to do 1000 pull-ups, 1000 push-ups, 1000 sit-ups....every night.
Now, Im gonna straighten you out on something....the STYLE today is more in neutral....so, it looks nicer but, take it from me....some of these stars today have set-ups that can be seen a mile away- many have their takedown diagnosed prior to the shot...most rarely finish their shot. I can name 100 wrestlers from before that would have been GREAT today if , the current style and rules were as they are today. Many cant comprehend this.
Being that you want to challenge my "non career" in Wrestling.....I will let you in on something- Holy Family (today's St Anthonys}CHSAA. Huntington HS-Sec. XI, Walt Whitman HS Sec. XI,, and Syosset HS Sec. VIII....a total of 3 miles divide them all...get that....3 miles east/ west/ north /south . In 1974-75. there were (7) FULL DI Football scholarships, (2) 1/2 scholarships...and many of the rest played JUCO/ DII and DIII Football.....Tom Donovan (PSU) went on to play for the Phila Stars, Kurt Sohn (NC St- Nassau Comm) went on and played for the Jets, Matt Kupec (NC), Kevin Mannix (OSU). John Scully (BC) went on to play for the Atlant Falcons, Joe Puca (Cinn), Dave Loehle (New Hamp)....others chose Baseball / Basketball instead...This is just from a 3- mile radius - in one area. So, please speak from your mouth and not from your azz....I guess these guys didnt TRAIN MORE....lmfao !!!! I would bet the house - that last year all of NYS - didnt have this many full DI Football scholarships
ps...WE ALL QUIT.....a FELINE can be a Lion or a Cat. You wont find the difference on a smartphone. You can on a mat or on a field.
Lastly, "private lessons"...LMFAO !!!! Who prey tell is giving these private lessons ??? Guys who wrestled when ??? Guys who were taught by someone too.... too funny !!!!
Teemer will need to expand his talents at this level....and until he can ride for 1 minute.... IMO more chances he will be back in Long Beach, LI than ever seeing an AA.
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Jan 26, 2019
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bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 166
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The sad part is you believe what you say.... but what you say is so wrong.
You have a right to your opinion, but you think that like your cornhole yours don’t stink.
Once again the NY boys will do better then the average of the last 40 years and you won’t answer to that when it happens. There will never be a time that you will admit the obvious, ala David Taylor and countless stupid comments you have made so why do you enter these forays? Surely it is not the exchange of thoughts because your weak mind is incapable of learning new things?? Or is this all about the pot stirring for you. Anyhow I pity your lack of ability to learn, but you could change that if you wanted.
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Jan 26, 2019
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quickpick
Joined: Jan 9, 2015
Posts: 284
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[quote="LImarty]
Lastly, "private lessons"...LMFAO !!!! Who prey tell is giving these private lessons ??? Guys who wrestled when ??? Guys who were taught by someone too.... too funny !!!!
.[/quote]
What happened to “it doesn’t matter if you were a good wrestler or not, anyone can coach?” And to answer the question Jeff Prescott (when did he wrestle again?) runs a wrestling club in section VI and I’m pretty sure Gregor Gillespie works with several LI kids right now too. Wasn’t there a family from the LI area a few years ago that had Max Askren in their corner all of the time? It’s a shame we can’t find anyone good to work with our kids in NY!
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Jan 26, 2019
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LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
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Look Araneo,
If, you didnt live it....you should keep your fingers off the panel- and use them to pick your nose and/or butt.
You specifically - are CLUELESS.
....................
Gillespie and Prescott wrestled when the STATE was full of SHARKs....Actually, one of the BEST HS weight classes in 20 yrs. 130 lbs- Shawn Riley, Steven Brown ,Gregor Gillespie, Joey Whitaker...Cataldi, Cartwright.....I believe a total of 3-4 losses for all. Who schooled Prescott, Gillespie.....??? Before there was a Nick or Vito Arujau...there was a Vougar Arujau.
YOU CAN HAVE KING KONG TRAIN YOUR KID...BUT, IF YOUR KID WILTS LIKE A FOUR DAY ROSE....IT DONT MATTER !!
Go to the past 10 yrs of NY State Champs from both Div. 1 and Div. 2.....and give me the list of NYS Champs who made it to a DI NCAA Quarter Finals. (?????)
In the early 00's- there were about 10 NYS Champs from both Section XI and Section VIII......ALL of these wrestlers got their start with Rick and Ken Brodmerkal - the Brodmerkals wrestled at Lindenhurst, HS back in the 70s . Point is.....NONE of these wrestlers AA'd in NCAA DI...only one or two even wrestled in DI.
Again, Jesse Jantzen - the last from Suffolk Co./2004 and Tom Ryan the last NCAA DI Finalist from Nassau Co/ 1991.......JMO seems a little long between drinks.
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Jan 26, 2019
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bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 166
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Problem is your opinion isn’t worth the space it is typed on. Moment after proverbial moment you spew your ridiculous diatribe and the process is the same. You state conjecture as fact, ask a question that is unanswerable then tell people to “look it up”. I won’t play anymore. Two years ago and last year, I “looked it up” and we found you were wrong then, why would now be different? Your questions were answered then and the best you could do was hide for 6 months and never address the fact that you were buried. You have no accountability to your inaccuracies so why would anyone with even your limited mental abilities engage you again in this manner. Admit you are wrong for the things you are wrong about, and we can begin anew. Like a broken clock you have been correct about things, but the few times you are right are clouded out by the many times you are wrong or salacious for the sake of getting attention. Until you can engage people like an adult it is my purpose to show people what a coward (hiding behind a screen name and throwing bombs at young men whose shoes you aren’t classy enough to shine), what a fool (how often you are wrong), and what a hypocrite (the way you change the goals when people engage you in civil conversation) you are. Stop calling out kids, and I will leave you alone to your useless prattlings. Continue to call out kids will get you chastised for the worthless worm you are.
Rob Araneo
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Jan 26, 2019
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provocateur
Joined: Dec 21, 2006
Posts: 1143
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You didn't live it, Marty. And how much of it did you watch? Did you ever to to the War Memorial? Gillespie wrestled post 2000. Prescott graduated in what? 1989?
You ran these kids down in their day. Now you want to use them to build a case. It's pathetic.
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Jan 27, 2019
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LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
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pathetic ??? was the wrestling at the Eastern State Tourney. Once- it had the best going at it in the quarters/semis..... War Memorial, Prescott ??? Did you know Lindsay Biagini /Massapequa lost two High School matches in NYS...one to a future NCAA Champ ( Rosselli) and the other to an Olympic Alternate (Weiderman). btw- Rosselli and Weiderman were challenged in NYS. Yeah, the same talent is here in NYS today...LMFAO !!!
YOU can sway your argument back and forth - in opposition of anything I say yet, I am consistent- THIS SPORT in NYS is at it's worst- comparable to the late 50s. I have seen MANY wrestlers who never achieved a Section Championship- those that were schooled- talented and would imo - would be multiple time champions today.
Yes, I dont have to go back too many decades- last decade had.....Sec. 3 had kids named Joe Jewitt/ Chris Horning/ Anwar Goeres who imo would wreck many of these kids who are today's #1s - trust me these kids were that good......want go back to Long Beach wrestler Jon Masa comes to mind. I havent seen a "slicker" wrestler than him in NYS....Wrestled 130 at the NYS Tourney and lost to Ruff of Sec. 4- Masa was sucked out for the Tourney and looked terrible in his opening match. Wrestled up at the Virginia Beach Tourney at 135 - won the whole thing...lol...then went on to being a 3x NCAA DI AA. Only two wrestlers were in his way of a title Esposito.OK St and Schlatter/OSU. Go back another decade to wrestlers like Anthony Riccardi- never won a NYS Title- lost in NY to future DI wrestlers the Mansueto bros yet, Coach Tom Ryan made him Hofstra's #1 recruit. This was the LAST decade for multiple talented DI recruits. There were NYS wrestlers...in the EIWA, ACC, Colonial, and BIG 10 with regularity....others were winning JUCO titles and DIII titles.
To this day I wonder how James Strouse became a DI semi-finalist from Hofstra.....1X NYS Champ- improved /raised his game by rolling around with Assist. Rob Anspach - right to an NCAA DI AA. In HS Strouse was always challenged in Nassau Co....Weidman the same.
I dont like what Im seeing...today. The best kids in NYS are not producing results in DI Wrestling. Look, Hofstra which is in a very marginal conference compared to the BIG 10...Hofstra/Binghamton/ Buffalo/ Cornell have how many former NYS Champions wrestling at these four institutions ??? Other than one of the Deprez brothers with a very outside shot of an AA...and long shot Lantry....now, that Vito is at Cornell I guess -maybe. WHY ??? no regular - BIG 10 starters ?...Rasheed , Rodriguez (no AA),and Paddock (no AA)...the last 10 yrs. Funny , Long Island natives Tom Ryan and Kerry McCoy are not recruiting with regularity from NYS anymore..Delvecchia isnt support for your argument....btw- Dan Gable use to recruit in NYS and was at the War Memorial regularly in the 70s/80s.
Here's another good one for you. Michael Patrovich won a NYS title at 152 lbs....then went to Virginia Beach- wrestled 145 lbs and won a Senior's title. What makes this unique the same year ..Ryan Maurer a 2X NYS Champ was ranked #1 in the nation at 145 lbs- but, he did not wrestle his senior yr- A year later he was a JUCO Champ and a North Carolina St recruit...never went to NC St. btw..Patrovich became a DI NCAA AA. Very similar to NYS wrestling today.....yeah, right.
NYS wrestling is down- PERIOD !!!
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Jan 27, 2019
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bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 166
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What is the standard for NYS wrestling being down? Your pedantic delusional diatribe or something tangible like your last argument with me which was AA status at NCAA for New Yorkers? When we last left this topic two years ago and last year I showed you our AA status has been up been down but for our current time we are right at the mean... anyhow you can go on for hours about this one or that one but give us tangibles.... you can’t you just reset your little red button on your brain and start over. By the way just because you lie like a rug doesn’t mean anyone believes you. On many occasions you stated that David Taylor’s style of wrestling would not get him success at the international level, you did not parse your words because you like Dake better, you are fooling yourself and no one else with the two sides you have taken on just that individual, never mind how you berated everyone from Troy Nickerson to now they all sucked compared to some unknown wrestler from Huntington that you were stroking since 1970, so spare us the kind words for jantzen, Nickerson and others that you now laud to make yourself seem reasonable.
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Jan 27, 2019
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LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
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FACT- (4) DI New York State Universities- Cornell, Buffalo, Binghamton, Hofstra,- have the majority of their starters from outside of New York State....and for those Dads who carried the EDUCATIONAL Flag of the Ivy Leagues...even their starters are primarily void of NYS wrestlers-
Araneo. You are a "light weight" on these Forums...always with a post- seldom with anything to add or / any contrasting views OR ANY HISTORY.
NEW YORK WRESTLING is a shell of what it was.
GET THIS INTO YOUR HEAD.....Nassau/Suffolk wrestlers from the late 90s- early 00s....would feast on most of these wrestlers -wrestling in NY today.
.................
David Taylor. David Taylor.....lol. !!!! Too funny.....that this is your comeback. David Taylor 0-4 against Kyle Dake.....and Kyle Dake is not even considered in the Top 10 HS wrestlers ever from New York. If, you need any scrap paper to figure this one out.,,,you have a roll in that little room.
Last edited by LImarty on Jan 27, 2019; edited 1 time in total
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Jan 27, 2019
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bigkidsdad
Joined: Feb 18, 2017
Posts: 166
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Marty, I live in the real world, where facts matter and character matters. If I lived in your world I would hid behind a screen name and throw firebombs all day on a wrestling forum. Simply address the fact your initial argument with me you lost... you may want to have another one I see that you can’t stay focused and prattle out meaningless information that doesn’t stand up to the facts we know. Originally you stated that NY’ers were not placing at the same rate as they did in the past, I proved you wrong, now what is the argument? That in the 70’s and 80’s we were better, the best barometer for that would be international success and I would love to see the research on that, you just won’t do it you will babble on and on and on... sorry words mean things and just because you like a thousand monkeys at a 1000 typewriters can type something resembling English doesn’t mean it’s true...
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Jan 27, 2019
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LImarty
Joined: Nov 28, 2003
Posts: 1130
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YOU PROVED NOTHING.
Except for a few- NYS wrestling is not a place to recruit from.
Find me a NYS Bracket such as this : 130 lbs NYS Tourney. 1) Shawn Riley / did not wrestle in College 2) Steven Brown, / AA at Central Michigan 3) Gregor Gilllespie/ NCAA Champ Edinboro 4) Joey Whitaker/ Fargo 2nd - wrestled at Buffalo U. 5ht and 6th had nearly perfect records. This is the last "solid" bracket in NYS.
.....THEN THE MUSIC DIED !!!
I gave you facts- and- I gave you my educated opinion. You are the 100th parent that needs to bolster your ego- and- your kids 15 minutes of fame.....time is running out.
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